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Mapudungun Wikipedia

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submitted verification final decision

This language has been verified as eligible.
The language is eligible for a project, which means that the subdomain can be created once there is an active community and a localized interface, as described in the language proposal policy. You can discuss the creation of this language project on this page.

Once the criteria are met, the language committee can proceed with the approval and will verify the test project content with a reliable neutral source, such as a professor or expert.

If you think the criteria are met, but the project is still waiting for approval, feel free to notify the committee and ask them to consider its approval.

  • The community needs to develop an active test project; it must remain active until approval (automated statistics, recent changes). It is generally considered active if the analysis lists at least three active, not-grayed-out editors listed in the sections for the previous few months.
  • The community needs to complete required MediaWiki interface translations in that language (about localization, translatewiki, check completion).
  • The community needs to discuss and complete the settings table below:
What Value Example / Explanation
Proposal
Language code arn (SIL, Glottolog) A valid ISO 639-1 or 639-3 language code, like "fr", "de", "nso", ...
Language name Mapudungun Language name in English
Language name mapudungun Language name in your language. This will appear in the language list on Special:Preferences, in the interwiki sidebar on other wikis, ...
Language Wikidata item Q33730 - item has currently the following values:
 Item about the language at Wikidata. It would normally include the Wikimedia language code, name of the language, etc. Please complete at Wikidata if needed.
Directionality LTR Is the language written from left to right (LTR) or from right to left (RTL)?
Links Gramática Básica de la Lengua Mapuche, Curso básico de lengua mapunzugun (at Logos), Mapuche o araucano (mapudungu) Links to previous requests, or references to external websites or documents.
Site URL arn.wikipedia.org langcode.wikiproject.org

Settings
Project name "Wikipedia" in your language
Project namespace usually the same as the project name
Project talk namespace "Wikipedia talk" (the discussion namespace of the project namespace)
Enable uploads no Default is "no". Preferably, files should be uploaded to Commons.
If you want, you can enable local file uploading, either by any user ("yes") or by administrators only ("admin").
Notes: (1) This setting can be changed afterwards. The setting can only be "yes" or "admin" at approval if the test creates an Exemption Doctrine Policy (EDP) first. (2) Files on Commons can be used on all Wikis. (3) Uploading fair-use images is not allowed on Commons (more info). (4) Localisation to your language may be insufficient on Commons.
Optional settings
Project logo This needs to be an SVG image (instructions for logo creation).
Default project timezone Continent/City "Continent/City", e.g. "Europe/Brussels" or "America/Mexico City" (see list of valid timezones)
Additional namespaces For example, a Wikisource would need "Page", "Page talk", "Index", "Index talk", "Author", "Author talk".
Additional settings Anything else that should be set
Once settings are finalized, a committee member will submit a Phabricator task requesting creation of the wiki. (This will include everything automatically, except the additional namespaces/settings.) After the task is created, it should be linked to in a comment under "final decision" above.

Proposal

Mapudungun is an isolated language spoken in Chile and in Argentina by Mapuche people. There are between 150,000 to 600,000 speakers (quantities vary according to the method of study). The language has three major scripts, however none is universally accepted. There was another proposal here, and the localisation is at work.

Discussion

Arguments in favour

  • Support, this language is in danger, a very good way to help would be creating a wikipedia... There are 440,000 speakers (strangely, formerly 600,000). It is the heritage of Chile and Argentina, if you lose it, it would be like losing history, think they already lost 150,000 speakers... // Este idioma está en peligro, una muy buena forma de ayudarlo sería creando una wikipedia... existen 440.000 hablantes (extrañamente, antes eran 600.000) Es patrimonio de Chile y Aregentina, si se pierde sería como perder historia, piensen que ya se perdieron 150.000 hablantes... --Clerc 00:39, 24 August 2008 (UTC) (Somos varios hablantes de arn 1 en wikipedia en español)[reply]
  • Support A favor: El proyecto tiene posibilidades de realizarse y tendría como beneficiarios potenciales a una cantidad de personas que va entre las 150 mil y las 600 mil en Chile y Argentina. Existen artículos ya iniciados en el incubador y se está traduciendo lentamente la interfaz en Betawiki. Todo depende de que concurran a participar hablantes nativos. 22:26, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
  • Support A favor: Aparte de que puede ayudar a más de 600.000 personas dando conocimiento libre en su propia lengua, también puede evitar la desaparición del idioma mapuche. --Chabi 13:49, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support A favor: A difficult project but a very useful one for all the Mapuches. Useful for Chile and Argentina. Sería un proyecto difícil pero demasiado útil para los hablantes de este idioma ya sea en Chile o Argentina. El proyecto ayudaría a evitar que desaparezca esta hermosa lengua.
  • Support A favor: Se ayudaría a que no desaparezca esta lengua que está a punto de desaparecer --ignacio01
  • Support: There are people in the Wikipedia community (specially in Spanish Wikipedia) that can help in this project. Also, this is an endagered language in Latin America. And finally, the Chilean President Michelle Bachelet appealed personally to Jimbo Wales for the creation of this wikipedia. --Taichi - (あ！) 00:48, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It's true, there are some politics problems about the standarization of mapudungun. Below some people say it, and they are right. But, if we wait they resolve themselves, we can start to work when the language was death language. I am not an expert, but I know a few, I recognize it, but in my cathegory of wingka, mestizo and others, I feel this is a fight which is worth to fight.200.54.151.82 21:06, 20 February 2009 (UTC)kmolfloyd[reply]

  • Felepe

Mari mari kom pu ce, Iñce ta kiñe mapuce mogelekelu Puelmapu mew, Wenosay mu; cijkatulen ka kimeltucelen tayiñ Mapucezugun. Iñciñ pu mapuce kvzawkvlerkeyiñ tayiñ zoy mapucezuguleal: mvlerkey zoy 700.000 mapuzuguci ce, ka ixofijke kimeltucefe mvlekerkey fij mapu mew. Tañi rakizuamkvlen, tici Wikipetia rume kejuay ñi mvleafuetew; mvlele taci wikipetia, iñce piafiñ tañi cijkatufe ñi cijkaqetew egvn, fey mew ñi zoy kvme kimkimtuleyegvn. Mvlerkey fijke wiriel az may, welu ¿mvlelay kam tici rupaltupeyvm ñi rupayafiel kiñeke wiriel ka wiriel pvle, Serfiuzugun erke? Azkvnutuwe mew kom taci zugu pepi ñi zewman. Iñciñ pu mapuce rume kvzawkvletuyiñ tayiñ wiñomapuzuguael kom Meli Wixal Mapu pvle, fey mew mvha kvme tici mapuce ñi wikipetia ñi mvlerkeafuy. Feypiken may.

Hola a todos, Soy un mapuche que esta viviendo en Puelmapu, en Buenos Aires; estoy estudiando y enseñando nuestro idioma. Nosotros los mapuche estamos trabajando para fomentar el uso del Mapuzugun: hay más de 700.000 hablantes, y varios maestros enseñando en diversos lugares. Pienso que esta Wikipedia, de existir, ayudaría mucho; si existiera, le diría a mis alumnos que la leyeran y así aprenderían mejor. Es cierto que hay distintas formas de escribirlo, pero ¿no existen acaso herramientas para pasar de un sistema de escritura a otro, como en el idioma serbio? Con las computadoras todas estas cosas pueden hacerse. Nosotros los mapuche estamos trabajando muchísimo para recuperar nuestro idioma en los cuatro puntos cardinales de nuestro territorio, por lo que sería muy bueno que existiera esta wikipedia mapuche. Esto es lo que digo.

Hello everybody, I am a mapuche, living in Puelmapu , in Buenos Aires; I am studying and teaching our language. We, the mapuche people, are working to increase the use of the Mapuzugun: there are more than 700,000 speakers, and a number of teachers teaching it in different places. I think that this wikipedia, if it becomes a reality, will help a lot; if it existed, I would tell my students to read it and so they could learn better. It is true that there are different ways of writing it, but ¿does not exist tools to transcribe from a system of writing to another, like in Serbian? With the computers all this kind of things are possible. We the mapuche are working very hard to recuperate our language to the four cardinal points of our territory, so it would be great if this wikipedia existed. This is what I say. --Kaniw 02:21, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Add yourself into "Proposal summary" - "Users interested in forming an editing community:" as "[[User:Kaniw|Kaniw]] ('''N''')" in order to support this project. --虞海 (Yú Hǎi) 05:17, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Also, help the Development wiki project. --虞海 (Yú Hǎi) 05:21, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support There are wikipedias in Aymara, Guaraní, Nahuatl and Quechua languages, why not a wikipedia in Mapudungun as well? Nations such as Bolivia, Mexico, Paraguay, and Peru have inherited a great deal of their cultural viewpoints from these languages, and all of them have enriched the Spanish language spoken in those countries by adding native words and expressions. Though with some difference, the same can be said about Mapudungun language in Chile and Argentina. Unfortunately, Mapudungun is falling into disuse. It is true that there are different ways to represent Mapudungun sounds, but this is exactly the same case with Emiliano-Romagnolo dialects, Dutch/Flemish in the Netherlands and Belgium, Portuguese in Brazil and Portugal, and even English in the USA and in the UK. Instead of letting the fourth Amerindian language spoken in South America, after Quechuan languages, Guaraní and Aymara, disappear little by little, give it a chance to become a source of knowledge for all its speakers. Thanks a lot for reading this message. --Alpinu 09:31, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support: Support...Estoy a favor de abrir una wikipidia en lengua mapuche y también en otras lenguas nativas de América; aunque resulte dificil al principio encontrar cibernautas indígenas o hablantes nativos debido a la falta de aparatos tan cotidianos en zonas urbanas como computadoras e internet, los proyectos en estas lenguas si funcionan en las lenguas que estan dejando de ser solo orales y se estan convirtiendo en gráficas para su enseñanza.--Marrovi 22:37, 2 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support This have to be accepted. Esto tiene que aceptarse. --Fire in the hole! 19:43, 28 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • a quite alive language of a proud ethnic group. → «« Man77 »» [de]·[bar] 23:08, 5 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support --MIKHEIL 15:55, 22 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support --Jugydmort 18:58, 18 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • (normal to weak) support - enough content to start (over 350 pages) and the Chilean President even supports this. This would be a "strong support" if there was still activity there. πr2 (t • c) 20:34, 18 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. There is enough material to get started. A new Wikipedia in Mapudungun would be both beneficial to the project of free knowledge and the awareness of the Mapuche people and cause in Chile and abroad. In 2008 the president of Chile, Michelle Bachelet, offered help from the State of Chile to create, promote and mantain a future Mapudungun Wikipedia, in order for the Mapuche community to have access to information and knowledge in their own language. [1] She is no longer the president, however, but the relevance of such an effort has been recognized by the Government! (and that is a feat over here!) --Cuatro Remos (talk) 03:57, 25 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong support I believe that mapuche language is endangered not because their speakers are diminishing. Interest and speakers are growing. It is endangered because of governmental policies, national and international, past and present, that promote the reduction of cultural diversity, one of the most important human cultural characteristics. I believe that from the Wikimedia movement we must act accordingly to preserve and promote the 5th most spoken language in South America and the wisdom it brings to humanity. -- Cbrescia (talk) 22:34, 19 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Arguments against

  • Oppose The proposers indicate a level one knowledge of the language. There are political problems with the orthography of this language; the Chilean government has standardised the language against the wishes of the Aurocana people as I remember it.. I really want native people involved in order to press ahead with this proposal. Thanks, GerardM 05:35, 25 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • I'm following the Mapudungun Test and it seems they found someone with a high level of knowledge (though still no native..). I had also proposed to contact Wikimedia Argentina, because they have a program to help native American languages. SPQRobin (inc!) 09:06, 25 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
      • GerardM, yes, the project only can be approved (?) when there be a community of native speakers. However, now that it is possible (but I think that this proposal is a little hurried). The problems with ortographies can be solved with authomatic transformation if there is no agreement. In Incubator and Betawiki we Clerc and me use "Alfabeto Unificado" (i. e.: mapudungun) that is used in many publications related to Mapudungun, but Chilean government and some Mapuche organizations use "Grafemario Azümchefe" (i. e.: mapuzugun) and another Mapuche organizations use "Grafemario Raguileo" (i. e.: mapuzugun). Contacts with Wikimedia Argentina are in progress, in fact, now I'm writing a letter (e-mail). Bye. Lin linao 14:53, 25 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
        • I already contact a native speaker through the Internet, and given him information about the project, told him about the system of wikipedia, its objectives and partners of the project and is interested. On the alphabet, we normally unified is the simplest and used (When it) // Yo ya contacte un hablante nativo mediante Internet, le e dado información sobre el proyecto, le dije sobre el sistema de wikipedia, sus objetivos y los colaboradores del proyecto y se ve interesado. Sobre el alfabeto, usamos normalmente el unificado que es el más simple y usado (Por lo que se)--Clerc 20:18, 25 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Other discussion

Anybody review the legal issues with providing a Mapudungun wiki (see this)? --MarsRover 04:33, 25 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Problem about Windows it was the script (developed by Chilean Government and defined as official without agreement of Mapuche society) and a fear for Microsoft could be copyright the language. A Wikipedia is not a threat and Mapudungun speaking people will be the basis of wiki-community. Bye. Lin linao 00:55, 27 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The script is the Latin script. What you are talking about it orthography. Also you cannot copyright an orthography. GerardM 05:28, 27 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
MarsRover and me were talking about that link and about possibilities of a similar problem with Wikipedia. --Lin linao 20:26, 28 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Grafemarios

Marimari kom pu che, ¿No hay alguna posibilidad de tener Wikipedia en alfabeto Unificado? Me parece que, después de todo, es el grafemario con mayor aceptación. Eso no significa que se deba eliminar la Wikipedia en Ragilew, ambas pueden convivir (e incluso ser calcos una de la otra). Hcampbellsills

arn

ENGLISH:arn is derived from "araucanio" a pejorative term for both the mapuche people and their language. This is similar to "nigger" or "chink" when a mapuche person is called this. I suggest since we may use additional ISO codes (new ones) for languages with multiple names (something that is allowed), that we employ something closer to "mapudungun" since that is the name of the project and by far the most common name of the language as spoken by its native speakers. since it is not taken[2] i suggest we use "map" and forget about the archaic, offensive, and divisive arn. In fact many mapuche are very proud and may not even contribute to a project once noticing the arn. What do you all think?

ESPAÑOL:arn es derivado de "araucano" un término ofensivo para ambos los mapuches y su lengua. Aquel es similar a "sudaca" o "mojado" cuando se le dirige a una persona mapuche. Sugero que utilizamos un código ISO adicional (uno nuevo) para idiomas con múltiples nombres, (algo que se permite), algo empleemos algo más cerca a "mapudungun" por que aquel es el nombre del proyecto y aparte de todo es el nombre más común del lenguaje en la manera que se habla por sus hablante nativos. Tomando en cuenta que no está ya en uso [3] sugiero que usémos «map» y olvidemos el arcaico, ofensivo y divisivo arn. De hecho muchos mapuches son orgullosos y podrían ni contribuir al proyecto cuando se fijen del arn. ¿qué piensan uds.? Troyster87 13:04, 22 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hola, me tomé la libertad de corregir errores ortográficos en tu mensaje. Pienso lo mismo que tú, pero no tengo claro si puede hacerse. Saludos. Lin linao 14:17, 22 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

EN: I think the same, arn is not a good name, due to its pejorative history. Map, mpz, or other may be better. ES: Pienso lo mismo, arn no es un buen nombre, debido a que tiene una historia peyorativa. Map, mpz u otro podría ser mejor. 200.54.151.82 20:53, 20 February 2009 (UTC)KMOLFLOYD 20/01/2009[reply]

There is no chance at all that another code will be used then arn. We have adopted the ISO-639-3 standard and there are other languages where the code is not really appropriate fin for suomi for instance. Thanks, GerardM 05:30, 27 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It will be a big problem. --Lin linao 20:15, 28 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I see your point, GerardM, but I beg to differ: On the one hand, fin for suomi is kind of appropriate because of the other official language spoken in Finland: Swedish (Finska, "Finnish" in Swedish) and, on the other hand, it does not have a negative or pejorative connotation. How would you feel knowing that the code of your language ("arn" in this case) comes from a derogatory name ("Araucanian")? At the same time, it calls my attention that Nahuatl, Aymara, Quechua, and Guaraní have their respective codes according to their names: (29 different codes for Nahuatl dialects, most of them starting nh-), ay, qu, and gn, respectively. In the case of Mapudungun code, this might have been done by asking the ones who speak the language, instead of imposing a code created by the ones who are only able to read about it. Thanks for reading this message. --Alpinu 09:51, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe mdn could be a good option, from MapuDunguN. As Lin linao says, the term "araucano" is pejorative. Nobody would accept, for example, Wikipedia in "nigga" or in "yankee". Hcampbellsills (talk) 11:21, 19 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, but I agree GerardM that we needn't think such abuse-calling words could make such nonsense "inappropriate"s, there are also iso639-3:tmd (compare with Chinese "他妈的/他媽的" lit. f*ck damn it), iso639-3:ass (would you consider "Ipulo-holes" every night?), iso639-3:ntr (psst, would you like to netorare, especially with a Delo girl? I'm sorry if I'm introducing child pornography here), iso639-3:wtf (what a famous "what the f*ck" code, :p) ... available, but are users of those languages hating their codes? I don't think so. --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 14:23, 27 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Also be aware that iso639-3:map is Austronesian languages, iso639-3:mpz is Mpi language, iso639-3:mdn is Mbati language, so non of those 3 codes shall be available. --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 14:33, 27 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I understand, that there is an emotional problem with arn, but the ISO code arn does NOT mean Araucanian languages! Araucanian languages (no ISO code as far as I know) are a family of two languages: Mapudungun (ISO code 'arn') and Huilliche (ISO code 'huh'). (Whether 'huh' is a dialect of 'arn' or not, we should not discuss here!) In my opinion two things should be done: 1. Continuing with this arn-project, whether we like the abbreviation or not. 2. Starting an initiative to change the w:en:ISO code for the reasons mentioned above.
It would be very bad an sad, if we didn't continue this project only because of a bad abbreviation. --Murma174 (talk) 18:10, 23 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]
It does not seem like there is much enthusiasm either. There is nearly no activity in the incubator and I think creating the wiki would by itself attract a lot of attention. Bedivere (talk) 01:02, 27 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Not to mention that there are other WIkipedias like the Chamoru with nearly the same number of articles and have existed with their own domain for nearly two decades and has never had much activity. What is wrong with the Mapudungun? Bedivere (talk) 01:03, 27 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Localisation update

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