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The following discussion is preserved as an archive of a closed Meta-Wiki request. Please do not modify it.

Assassas77

[edit]

Hi,

I request the rights for translation adminship to be able to add content translation markup on pages of Wikimédia France, as a member of the Board of Trustees of Wikimedia France, to make our content more available for non-French speakers.

I've already worked with the Translation Extension as a user/translator. I've checked how it is done on multiple pages, how to use the tvar syntax and best practices regarding paragraphs and sentences tagging.

--Assassas77 (talk) 15:03, 5 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]


@Pols12:, @Pppery:, @Ameisenigel: Following this page directive Meta:Internationalization guidelines, I've added a <translate> and a </translate> tag to this page Learning patterns/Firm foundation for projects I intend to translate. Now, I need a person with Translate Admin rights to do the next step, right ? :) Assassas77 (talk) 00:47, 20 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

You've just proven that you have no understanding of proper markup segmentation (and thus we were right to oppose this proposal). this is how you properly prepare a page for translation, not just sticking <translate> and the beginning and </translate> at the end. * Pppery * it has begun 00:55, 20 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I've done it on this page, is this correct ? : Learning patterns/Evaluating project outcomes Assassas77 (talk) 03:05, 20 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The page looks fine, but I still oppose this request as I've had to handhold you too much in reaching that point. * Pppery * it has begun 03:45, 20 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
In order to give more context on the request: I understand that it is a security mechanism to prevent vandalism or good faith errors. When I received the request from User:Pols12 to add tags for translation on one page, I understood that it was to check my understanding and skills before giving any extra privilege. I've read about translation extension before starting this request: I've check the guideline page you gave above. I also read pages on Meta and MediaWiki including those following indications:
Those indications seemed to contradict the Internationalization guidelines. However, in order to minimize the amount of efforts to be done in vain, I started by applying the shortest solution: 4. of mw:Help:Extension:Translate/Page translation example
I hope that these elements will clarify the interaction we had earlier. Assassas77 (talk) 03:59, 20 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The video shows minimal technical requirements, but this produces large units which are really painful to translate. That’s why recommendations are much more demanding.
The 4th step you mention is correct, given the example page content (no image, no cat, no table, heading followed by an empty line…).
Note you missed to prefix links with Special:MyLanguage/ which is also conventional on Meta-Wiki (at least for translatable pages).
-- Pols12 (talk) 19:54, 20 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks on your advice on links, I'll keep that in mind. Assassas77 (talk) 22:38, 20 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Pppery: Hello, Well, I went after you to complete your changes 1, 2 (and Pols12 too). Now that I also gave "a helping hand", maybe you can leave those stories behind. It is always interesting to complete a community with capable, enthusiastic and willing people. If you agree with his work, you can remain unhappy with the way this postulation went, but you cannot vote against without reason: I encourage you to vote neutral. Aware of the reluctance due to complexity, I nevertheless supported him from the first hour, because Assassas77 is, in the Movement, someone (and I notify others for verification) who goes in all directions and something positive always emerges. Even if he does not have this status, he will continue on his way without worrying about this episode. We all make mistakes and we are all in a hurry. If he makes mistakes, it will be time to remove this status, but I also know that he is open to criticism. Let's start with indulgence, instead of pulling out the stick to beat him, let's accompany, instead of punishing. Regards. —Eihel (talk) 04:13, 21 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I don't find this argument convincing at all (and I had never heard of Assassas77 before this request). It's effectively saying that translation admin bit (and by extension any other right) should be given to people based on personal friendships rather than logic. To be clear, the fact that I was the one doing the handholding is irrelevant, and I am instead opposing because it needed to be done at all. The belief that people should understand how to do things before requesting the ability to do them, rather than learning at the eleventh hour, is not vot[ing] against without reason or pulling out the stick to beat him. This request will likely succeed anyway as I'm a minority of one, but my oppose stands. * Pppery * it has begun 04:28, 21 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I don't know him, I just follow what he does. I have no acquaintance with this contributor, but his participation in various projects gives me a logical opinion. But we are not talking about me… or the contributors who support this application. —Eihel (talk) 05:15, 21 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Hi, I found your reaction really strange, Pppery. First, you said that this request shows how inefficient translation admins are. Maybe, it’s time to rethink how this work instead of attacking willing people. By any chance, if there is a page to ask for translations, please do not hesitate to give its name here. Second, I think it’s normal for someone who discovers a new feature to make mistakes. Your behaviour is unwelcoming. But maybe you can explain how someone is supposed to learn something without errors. Lepticed7 (talk) 11:33, 21 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Lepticed7:
  • I think translation admins have failed comment was only an encouragement of volunteers to apply.
  • Meta talk:Babylon and translators-l are right places to ask for translations.
  • Note Assassas77 is not asking for help with Translate feature, but he is asking for an advanced user right. Pppery is not to blame to notice a technical knowledge lack on a determining voting page. We’re clearly not in a newcomer forum.
-- Pols12 (talk) 21:25, 21 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • This is getting somewhat off-topic for this page, but my translations admins have failed comment was not intended as an encouragement, although it may well have that effect. The true significance of that comment that this kind of self-directed request (intending to use the translation admin bit on pages one is editing anyway) merely papers over an unresolved systemic issue rather than solving an actual problem, which is that there is far too little community-directed translation admin activity (meaning using translation admin rights on pages one has no other involvement with), like what you and me do. If there were enough community-directed activity (that is, the translation admins had not failed in their duty), then people would ideally not consider it necessary to make self-directed requests. See, for example, MediaWiki.org, the other multilingual wiki I'm active on, where Shirayuki makes sure all pages needing translation admin action get handled within a few days. * Pppery * it has begun 18:51, 22 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Done — xaosflux Talk 13:35, 25 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
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