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Padonki Wikipedia

[edit]
submitted verification final decision
This proposal has been closed as part of a reform of the request process.
This request has not necessarily been rejected, and new requests are welcome. This decision was taken by the language committee in accordance with the Language proposal policy.

The closing committee member provided the following comment:

This discussion was created before the implementation of the Language proposal policy, and it is incompatible with the policy. Please open a new proposal in the format this page has been converted to (see the instructions). Do not copy discussion wholesale, although you are free to link to it or summarise it (feel free to copy your own comments over). —{admin} Pathoschild 22:02:13, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Proposal summary
Please read the handbook for requesters for help using this template correctly.
  • Number of speakers: almost all Russians, more than half other Slav language
  • Locations spoken: Russian and ex-USSR Internet segment, also more and more people use it outside Internet

Support

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  1. (N) Support. --Jaroslavleff 06:49, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  2. Strong Support. --Hojja_Nusreddin 06:51, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    # Support. --193.19.83.9 06:53, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    # Support. --85.141.213.14 06:57, 16 August 2006 (UTC) Anonymous IP, please register or provide email[reply]
  3. Support. --Fallingfree 07:01, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  4. (N) Support for sure. This is a large culture and a WP in this language will be very successful. Csman 07:03, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  5. Support --Swix 07:11, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  6. Support, much more popular than so-called "siberian". MaxSem 07:16, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    And this Siberian is Language, but padonki is only abusive slang --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 02:44, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  7. (N) Support, very popular language in Internet --Pauk 07:22, 16 August 2006 (UTC) / ru:user:Pauk[reply]
  8. Support, much more peoples speak in "padonkian" then "siberian" (Ф дисятке и ниипёт :)--Morpheios Melas 07:26, 16 August 2006 (UTC) / (ru:user:Morpheios Melas +Sysop)[reply]
  9. Support, the language is wide spread all over the world —lstar 07:29, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  10. (N) Strong support, this language is really very popular in Russia. труъ! Edward Chernenko 07:36, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  11. Support. Wikipedia in this language will be very popular. --Zserghei 07:41, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    # Support. --195.131.209.98 08:03, 16 August 2006 (UTC) Anonymous IP, please register or provide email[reply]
  12. Support. --kolen 08:29, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  13. (N) Support. --AndyVolykhov 08:37, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  14. (N) Strong support. It is really popular and spoken. In contrast to Siberian VanHelsing.16
    # (N) Support --89.175.28.76 09:05, 16 August 2006 (UTC) Anonymous IP, please register or provide email[reply]
  15. Support. ф дватцадке. OckhamTheFox
  16. Support - unlike the infamous "Siberian language", it at least DOES really exist, and IS really popular among some groups. If there's a space for "Siberian language" in the wiki, there should be a space for the "Padonkian language", too. Despite none of them should be treated seriously, in my opinion. Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 11:01, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    There is no comparison between semi-criminal net slang and old dialect. And such comaprison is anti-siberian provocation. What harm did siberian language to the russians that you hate it so much? --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 21:51, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Just because "Siberian language" initiative is strictly anti-Russian one (or, as your companions say, anti-"Muscovite" one), that's why. I was initially neutral about "Siberian dialect", and supposed to support it. But after I checked the backgound and examined who does promote this "language" (West-Ukrainian nationalists, so on), I clearly understood that this "Siberian language" initiative is not anyhow related to increase of human knowledge at all, and serves political goals only. Don't suppose that other wikipedians are less clever than you. Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 11:05, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    How can language be "anti-" in political meaning? It only exists, it is not weapon or political book. So you yourself recognize, that you oppose siberian only for political goals, just because west-ukrainians support it? But this is false reasoning, and saving the old dialect of all the Russian North will certainly increase human knowledge. The personal insult in the last sentence indicates that you are simply angry and agressive, and this agression also makes your reasoning false. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 11:15, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Dear Yaroslav, you of course DO KNOW that I'm right and correct. I'm quite interesting in recovering any ancient Russian dialects and other historical facts about my precursors (I possess both Russian and West-Belorussian ancestry), and I'm particularly interested in Ladoga and Novgorod archeological excavations. It's why I see clearly that your "Siberian language" initiative has nothing common with history and science. The "Siberian language" initiative (not language, which is not existing, but initiative) is clearly anti-Russian. Period. Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 11:26, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Of course I know that you are not right, and both pomor and siberian language have the same northern russian lexical and grammatical base. The enemies of siberian did not say even ONE word in siberian that is not natural, they only cry - it is not natural - without any proofs of it. And how can not exist language with 15000 words and 1200 texts? You lie for political goals and this is clear. Especially this padonki request shows this. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 11:36, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    None of scientifically reliable texts of those that you refer above are about "Siberian language". They discuss local dialects only, while there's no scientifically known single common language (at the level you pretend). Your "Siberian language" project is a mixture of different dialects and fantazies. It doesn't anyhow help in recovering the real historic facts. And it the final period. Thank you for conversation. Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 11:52, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    The language was combined from dialects, just like any language do. The words in the language are real historic words, and this can be prooved. So this is lie about it's non-naturality, lie, made only for political goals which you yourself recognize. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 11:58, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Ok, I agree to assume that you personally are just bona fide mistaken. Then, may I recommend you to take a course in the linguistic science first? A language is a complex system, not just a random collection of words! The "Siberian language" initiative approaches are definitely unscientific. Sorry. Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 13:42, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Combined together they forms system, as it is shown in texts written in siberian language. Your system argument plays only against padonkian, because random misspelling russian words do not form language system, as in Padonkian case. But using old north words and old north grammar in complex texts - this is just language system of Northern Russian language. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 13:50, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Dear Yaroslav, if you promoted Siberian language as a conlang, I would agree. Yes, I suppose, that Siberian is a conlang, created in some political agenda. And this language potentially may exist in a status of the constructed language (artificial language), there are many different conlangs in the world, created for different goals, including political. But you pretend it to be a historic language that was a spoken language in the past - and this is an evidently wrong allegation. I'd even dare to name it "lie". One of these lies is that there are "native speakers of Siberian", in my opinion. That is clear for any person who studied linguistics even at basic level. Sorry, maybe I'm a bit insulting. Sorry! Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 05:40, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    No, I did never promote Siberian like "a historic language that was a spoken language in the past", but language is based on old dialects of Northern Russian. Theese dialects may have differences, and now we construct common standard for the Northern Russian. And this thing is clear and evident, also it is evident that the words were not invented. And native speakers of Siberian - they are speakers of dialects, which Siberian language codifies. And the situation is really clear for any person who studied linguistics even at basic level, but your political prejudices make you blind and abusive. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 06:45, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    It's a DIRECT AND BLATANT LIE!!! Here's a reference to an article, created by you. The linked text is quite comprehensible to me, and it states clearly enough that it is a historic language that was a spoken language in the past. Just say frankly that it is a conlang, state clearly that "Siberian language" is a conlang based on remnants of different dialects of old Ilmen Slovene language and other slavic and non-slavic languages, non-scientifically mixing them - and nobody (or at least, very few) would oppose it, I think. The opposition to your initiative is caused by this your attempt to conceal your political agenda. Your initiative has nothing common with recontruction of PIE, and even with infamous attempt of reconstruction of the world proto-language. Your initiative is unscientific. Sorry again, but I have to call things in their natural names. Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 08:14, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    STOP LIE YOURSELF. What is wrong with the article? Old siberians spoke by dialects of the language, which is codified now. Because words of the language were taken from their somewhat different dialects, this is their language. What is wrong and where is lie? If ANYBODY will propose OTHER STANDARD of North Slavonic, we shall not discuss with them. For example, pomors has somewhat other standrad, and there is no discussion between the siberian group and pomors. But you not only lie about Padonki slang - and this lie is evident and funny - you even lie about my position about the language. NOWHERE did I say that only this standard was spoken, but this is standard proposed by Siberian Volgota group, and there are nothing about this in the article about siberian language prohibited by ruwiki, there are nothing about this in Volgota site, in samir74 LJ, in 40 publications in media about the siberian project. You only lie for political causes. If any particular expression in the article "Siberian govor" in sibwiki disturbes you, you can change the expression by common way of Wikipedia, simply delete them. Maybe we simply do not understand the article or just my expression was not clear, it may be changed --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 08:29, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    # Support. --217.70.122.58 11:19, 16 August 2006 (UTC) Anonymous IP, please register or provide email[reply]
  17. (N) Support ф тридцатке--Lone Guardian 11:29, 16 August 2006 (UTC) / ru:user:Lone Guardian[reply]
  18. Support --Tassadar 11:53, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  19. Support. But in such case, also a Wikipedia for Kashenite Language should be created. It is also fairly widespead and can be understood by Russian speakers. See also: ru:Кащенизм, ru:Кащениты. --Oal 12:06, 16 August 2006 (UTC) / ru:user:Oal[reply]
  20. Support --Kink 12:57, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  21. (N) Support Finally, after falling of USSR we found a way to speak at out real language! Medvedov-Prevedkovich 13:29, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  22. (N) Support Padonki language is quite wide spread. It shall never be forgotten! --Zach0t 15:11, 16 August 2006 (UTC) ru:user:Lengra[reply]
  23. Support -- Serebr 17:08, 16 August 2006 (UTC) (ru:user:Serebr)[reply]
  24. Support Really language, it is very popular in Russian regions.--Nikolay Kolpakov 18:41, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  25. Support This language is really very popular in Russia and other post-USSR countries. I know many people whose native language is padonki language. This language is mush easier than Russian and Siberian! Падонки труЪ! - Oyster 04:28, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  26. Support дайте две! - Vald 21:45, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  27. (N) Support, yes! --Larap 05:34, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  28. (N) Strong support, there is really great number of people speaking it. MountainBlueAllah 09:17, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  29. Support, Strong support This must be very interesting projekt! Voting for both nearest to russian projects - padonki and siberian, both of them wiil be extremely cognitive!--A1 09:46, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  30. Support труъ езык, live, not conlang. Mikkalai 22:54, 25 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

# (N) Support Is a formed and widely spread language in Russia. Eugrus 12:04, 17 August 2006 (UTC) Голос снят проголосовавшим, см. ниже --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 07:13, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  1. Support бп -- GlamurnyMalcheg 04:19, 9 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose

[edit]

"Padonki" is in fact an artificial language developed by the internet community around www.udaff.com, and is nothing just banter and mocking on current Russian spelling system. The "padonki" language is just the mix of misspelled russian words (like "preved" instead of correct "privet"), obscene words (mostly genitals and the fucking, which -- compared to English or German -- is considered to be very offensive), and some words invented by the community. The language itself has no scientific value, since it is nothing but intentionally crippled Russian. I would like to warn the Wikipedia-community, that it is quite common among "padonki" to arrange flash-mobs aiming at vandalizing certain pages or cheating the polls. The link to current discussion has been posted on some "padonki"-pages, so, we should expect many anonym votes or those from just registrated wikipedians.. Alaudo 18:23, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Same as Siberian :) --Morpheios Melas 06:34, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
We have Bible in Siberian language. We have Quran in siberian language. You have in that slang only stories about fucking and violence. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 11:04, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
There's something like Bible (Genesis) in Padonkian, too. I don't remember exact link, but I have met this. Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 11:10, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Just atheistic parody of course, because the most popular words in padonkian are "fuck" and "cock". --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 11:17, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I do not care that Siberian language is, but the latter doesn't use offensive and sacred words as Padonki language, which is basically nothing but that. And the language itself is not vivid at all, if you compare it to let's say Barkov's Luka, it is just repeated using of same offensive constructions written in mangled Russian.
And, please, do not lie saying there are "native speakers". There are none. Native means you speak it basically at home, with your children and in family, and I do doubt it. So, there is nobody who speaks it and the whole mess-up here is just to entertain a couple of those "padonki", that's agaist the principle of Wikipedia! Alaudo 08:35, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think this is vandal proposing and should be deleted. Padonki slang is criminal in it's essence, so many criminals and people of similiar psychology will be interested, so wikipedia will have a large amount of vandals. Comparing to this, Siberian os only dialect of farmers, developed by some scholar enthusiasts, so they will play in siberian wiki, inventing names of the stars in Novgorod language, and nothing more)))--Yaroslav Zolotaryov 18:41, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's just a primitive slang which appeared few years ago and will die in 3-4 years. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 83.220.35.194 (talk • contribs) .

Same as Siberian :) --Morpheios Melas 12:15, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Siberian appeared in 7th century AC --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 14:11, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

O RLY? Please quote ANY reliable source proving that Slavic people lived there at that time (e.g. any archeological excavation data).--Shakura 14:26, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Siberian is codification of Novgorod Slavonic language (so called 'north russian dialect'). But the north russian has very few similiar to the "Russian" language, invented by Lomonosov in 18 century and used by Russian state and ruwiki.--Yaroslav Zolotaryov 14:30, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
So, it's a dead language VanHelsing.16
Yes, dead language with sufficient remains in modern farmer's dialects, we want to revive it, the same was in Europe with occitan, aragon, etc, etc, so why do russian nationalists hate such a natural process of reviving old dialects, very common in Europe? --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 15:24, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Last article about the siberian language, just read it and cease lie:

""Где можно купить книги на диалектах русского языка?" Вопрос моей финской знакомой застает врасплох. А нигде... Приобрести книги на диалектах русского в России невозможно. Приходится объяснять, что в СССР с диалектами боролись, а в современной РФ освоение медиа-пространства на поморском или сибирском диалекте великого и могучего находится в зачаточном состоянии. И занимаются этим исключительно энтузиасты, которых подчас записывают чуть ли не в сепаратисты." http://www.kasparov.ru/material.php?id=44E2DAC8CA37F

Every serious internet newspaper in Russia writes about tragedy of siberian people and siberian language, only 20 russian nationalists try to lie in international wikipedia about us. Stupid provocations combined with lie and personal insults - you are real descendants of your fathers, stalinist and czarists, who killed people speaking in novgorod-siberian and prohibited to write in it. You destroyed the Great Novgorod many times and your imperial civilization is founded on lie and violence. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 15:57, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]


If so, padonki's language is codification of ancient australian natives language. Edward Chernenko 15:39, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Such a stupid lie only shows that you are vandal. The slang was invented by udaffcom and has almost no differences from the russian--Yaroslav Zolotaryov 15:43, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose - only 50 words are different from the russian, grammar and pronunciation are the same. The voting itself is only russian nationalist flash-mob for stopping the development of Siberian wiki. Siberian wiki does no harm to the Russians, but they hate every old slavonic dialects in their territory, trying to stop their revival by any ways, even vandalizing in Meta. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 14:19, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Russian nationalism? OMG! I thought you were wiser... VanHelsing.16
And personal insults combined with lie - this is all what you can do against me --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 15:24, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Why should we do anything against you? All we want is a Wiki in our language! --Zach0t 15:35, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Меня просто дергает что склоняют сибирский. А вообще добро пожаловать в инкубатор)) Я даже не против вас принять в восточнославянское сообщество инкубатора) Когда начнется тестовая вика? --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 15:43, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
And how can we stop the development of Siberian wiki? It's founded. OK, we just want to have Padonkian as well! VanHelsing.16
+1 --Zach0t 15:35, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Just constant metioning of siberian in your mouths testifies about this. Having no proofs to you lie, having no support, hating real language of the Russian people, you again and again come to fight with siberian, again and again want to dictate your imperial language to the slavonians of Russia and Siberia--Yaroslav Zolotaryov 15:24, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
oh that's a kind of paranoia! I don't speak Siberian and I don't hate it (that's strange to hate a language). I don't dictate anything! I don't fight with it! If you want to speak it - speak. How can I deny using a language?!!
You use Sibearian, I use Padonkian. That's all. VanHelsing.16
So why did you vote against Siberian? --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 16:08, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I don't like the idea of Siberian wikipedia. OK, the language exists, but very few people use it and very few are interested in learning and using it. Wikiprojects must be large and useful. I don't believe it'll be large and useful (the amount of speakers is not enough). VanHelsing.16
But practice disproves this. After 2 months, in very bad condition in incubator, persecuted by the official ru-wiki, constantly attacked by Russian vandals, we have more than 1200 articles, written by 10 persons, this is 99th level from 228 wikipedias --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 16:38, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The voting itself is only russian nationalist flash-mob for stop the development of Siberian wiki.
Oh. So, I can also play this game. I insist on creating a kashenite Wikipedia, because non-creating it is a harrassing ignorance due to silencing the importance of jewish internet dialects by russian nationalists. Huh? --Oal 17:08, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
So you prove my own words, the majority of voters are just russian nationalists, crazy seeing prosperity of the siberian wiki. We are only 5 persons, and you fear us)))--Yaroslav Zolotaryov 17:13, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Where did I say it? I'm not just russian nationalist, I am rather a victim of them, being crushed by not-even-metioning the kashenite wiki. =] --Oal 17:38, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Если вы думаете, что умно смотритесь, превращая это место в форум, вы ошибаетесь)) Наоборот этот реквест - ваше полное поражение. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 18:10, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

You came just to prove this part of the article from Kasparov about the siberian language: Возьмусь утверждать, что языковые права всех россиян бессовестным образом попираются. С обычным русским тоже далеко не все в порядке. Достаточно включить телевизор. На контролируемых государством каналах находит свое место блатная и тюремная лексика, чего ни одно уважающее себя государство себе не позволяет. ("violating human rights and destroing real dialects, russian goverment supports criminal slang, widely used in TV and other media") The padonki slang is only subset of this criminal slang, who is based on non-slavic words of western origin. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 17:20, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Товарищ, если можете, возьмите себя в руки, пожалуйста -- вы уже своей сибирякией всех заебали. Здесь обсуждают совсем другое. Csman 18:40, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Прекратите материться в культурном месте. Please stop the offencive speaking and violating the rules of wikipedia. Отчего же якобы обсуждают совсем другое, а склоняют сибирский? --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 18:43, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Да никто ничего не склоняет! Кстати: прошу всех русских здесь воздержаться от выпадов в адрес сибирской вики. Мы вам не мешаем. Ну открыли вы свою вики, что теперь? Работайте, желаю вам удачи. Только уж другим не мешайте, ибо язык падонков действительно распространённее (это факт). Пожалуйста, Ярослав, не надо сейчас сыпать доказательствами. Всё, нам ваша сибвики до лампочки. А вот Ваш голос против с размусоливанием старой темы выглядит не то попыткой мелкой мести, не то вторым пиаром. Пожалуйста, давайте не будем больше обсуждать сибирский. По данному предложению Вы сказали: "этот язык ненастоящий, в нём нет грамматики, он придуман на удаффкоме, там только 30 слов". Это Ваш аргумент, и я его уважаю. Не мешайте и другим приводить свои аргументы. Edward Chernenko 18:52, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Кто начал склонять сибирский я или вы??? На самом деле я даже поддержал бы, если бы было хоть что-то позитивное. А так полукриминальный жаргон, практически идентичный с русским. Если вам лично сибвика до лампочки, какого хрена лично вы против нее голосуете? --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 18:56, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Какая разница, если её уже открыли? Я голосовал против открытия, потому что полагал, что такого языка не существует (и в противном меня никто не убедит, мнения известных мне коренных сибиряков в любом случае звучат гораздо весомее). Edward Chernenko 19:20, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
вы хоть понимаете смысл самой фразы "языка не существует"? как он может не существовать, когда есть кодифицированный словарь, грамматика и тексты? Язык определенно существует, если отличается от других языков и употребляется. В данном случае падонковский не язык, поскольку коммуникативно недостаточен - применяется только в одной сфере, материться в интернете. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 19:29, 16 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Ну йа матеръюсь и нитолько ф интырнете, и чта? -Lone Guardian 03:30, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
То, что это жаргон. Я тут не подписывался бесплатно преподавать за среднюю школу. Откройте любой словарь и посмотрите, что такое сленг. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 09:45, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]


  • Oppose Ochkarik 02:47, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Why? Edward Chernenko 09:11, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Я считаю, что данный язык должен сначала появиться в викисловаре (как и сибирский, я голосовал против сибирского языка в википедии), а уже затем , и в википедии, очень малый словарный запас слов в языке. Я считаю, что написать о новом викисловаре на Request for new languages/Non natural . C уважением, Ochkarik 09:34, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Translation of Ochkarik's comment: "I think this language should first appear in Wiktionary (just as siberian, I voted against siberian in Wikipedia) and only after that in Wikipedia. There is poor number of words in this language. I think you should first ask for new Wiktionary at Request for new languages/Non natural. Regards, Ochkarik" - translated by Edward Chernenko 12:09, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    Согласен, но туда не стоит постить как на искуственный язык, потому что у этого нет никаких признаков искуственного языка, например автора и того же самого словаря или грамматики --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 10:12, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose -- A. Yurkevich 10:50, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Lemme elucidate the situation abit. Padonki is not a language, it's more like a culture of appraisable commenting, commenting in the style much of Ella Shchukina from "12 Chairs". I'll remind, she used about 30 words to value any single event or object. Padonki are the same, they use some catchy phrases to value everything. So they act pseudo-dumb people. The important notice: all the phrases of padonki CAN BE TYPED WITH NO MISTAKES TO OFFICIAL RUSSIAN ORTHOGRAPHY, their culture allows it (u can type в десятке (transl.: i've got into the number of first 10 commenters) with no mistakes, or фдисятке, with mistakes).

Using the commenting padonki culture no one can create an article about, for example, Newton. The best one could be created imho sounds that way:

Ньютон исаак (пендосы: Newton Isaak) - первонах, фдисятке, фтопку, ниибёт.

The very simmilar culture (or subculture) of commenting in Russian is Troo-goth. It uses even fewer words to value things. They are:

    • Гламурна - excellent
    • Гламурненька - not bad
    • Гатич(ь)на - kewl
    • Аццкий сотона - the man that does thing in the coolest way
    • Труъ - true

As the persons understanding Russian can see, Troo-goth culture uses settled ungrammar forms of Russian words, and 1 (Труъ) word that is transliterated from English.

Article about Newton could be done only in such a way in Troo-goth:

Ньютон исаак (труъ: Newton Isaak) - гламурна, гатичьна, аццкий сотона, труъ.

Go then, there is even third culture in commenting (it's also a culture of funny pics) in Russian - Preved. It has born in 2005, and is a more radical form of orthographical art. It ridicules the Russian language as a language that doesn't follow a phonetic principe and has a lot of rules of "how to write it right". To make fun of Russian it goes even further from phonetic principe, replacing -ник- suffixes with -нег-, replacing -чик- suffixes with -чег-, -ик- suffixes with -ег- and replacing SOME -а- 's in the roots with non-phonetical -o- 's, -ий ends are replaced SOMETIMES with -ей, phonetical -е- 's in roots are also SOMETIMES replaced with non-phonetical -и- 's. The basic words of Preved are:

    • Превед - hello, or i'm here, or what a shit you wrote
    • Кросавчег - nice one, cool
    • Медвед - the bear in translation, the main hero and the 'God' of Preved culture. Often used with Превед word and then has the meaning of Превед word
    • Соучаснег - the object in 'Preved' pictures that Медвед always makes fun of (or with).
    • Кагдила? - How are you, how d'u feel
    • Паканирадила - the answer to Кагдила (haven't brought forth yet)
    • Пака - the answer to Превед (bb)

The article about Newton in Preved could be done but it'll have minimal difference from Russian.

And now there is an answer why I typed all this stuff. The language these people want to create wikipedia is called Olbanian (non-grammar version of 'Albanian' word) language. It consists of:

  • Padonki commenting
  • Troo-goth commenting
  • Preved commenting
  • +ungrammar text, like it often watched on russian forums, where non-educated or badly-educated young people (or the persons imitating them) make a lot of mistakes in words, phrases, sentences.

Olbanian is not codified and cannot be, because it's the 'cool' unique feature of it. The next year, forex, some words of Olbanian, will become unfashionable (Preved practically has already become it) and young people will create new forms.

Also, this proposition can mean the proposition of Kashchenitski language, which imitates how jews pronunce russian words. This language is ANTI-SEMITIC from the time of birth, and in fact has very little things to do with Olbanian language that's why I oppose it too.

Also, this proposition can mean the proposition of Ruzgey yezyg language (totally ungrammar variant of the name of ruslang in russian - Russkiy yazyk). It's extreme form of ortho-art and is too chaotic (where the russian word of 3 letters can contain 7 or more mistakes: ещё - йишсчио) I have nothing against such a creation, but as it's still not codified and is not going to be codified in near future I oppose it as TOO chaotic.


Такшта темаибли нираскрыто, фсем супортирам быстра фыпить йад. Мудоги. -- A. Yurkevich 10:50, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Too many letters. Apparently, you have no clue what padonki language is about. Although a few of your points are true, the rest are either irrelevant or plain false.
  1. It has way more rules than you think (according to your entry)
  2. If preved gets outdated, who cares? Every language in the world is evolving and expressions are falling out of use all the time.
  3. "Pseudo-dumb", "misspelled Russian" arguments are completely irrelevant. Belorussian, for instance, may seem to some like a misspelled version of Russian, but so what? I don't doubt for a second it's a valid language.
  4. No one in their right mind would confuse Kashchenitski and padonki, and mentioning anti-semitism in padonki context is just plain wrong: with this comment you seem to be trying to create a pointless hysteria about this request instead of a reasonable argument. Csman 18:26, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
What comparison can be between Belarusian language and this criminal slang? Do you understand what are you speaking about??? --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 18:37, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Товарищ, ну я же уже один раз попросил вас успокоиться. Какой ещё в задницу "криминал"? Вы вообще про Удава или превед хоть что-нибудь знаете? И кстати, про вежливость лучше скажите вашему ебанутому дружку (или сокпаппету?), который наверху собирается "всех москвичей утопить в крови". Вы просто больные люди. Пожалуйста, оставьте нас и нашу заявку в покое. Csman 18:58, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Пожалуйста, сами оставьте нас в покое, склоняя тут сибирский и теперь уже беларуский направо и налево. Киван собирается утопить в крови, если вы не дадите возродить сибирский насильственными средствами. Я не только знаю про Удава, я участвовал в К-К с 1999 года, и создал целую сеть КК-сайтов тогда у себя в регионе, когда была еще одна факра. Суть не в этом, а в том, что матерный сленг девиантного происхождения не может быть сравнен с полноценным языком и таким сравнением вы оскорбляете носителей других славянских языков, возможно сами не замечая этого. Хамство, с которым себя тут ведут товарищи с рувики, возможно, им самим незаметно, но на фоне общей вежливости должно бы резать глаз внешнему наблюдателю. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 19:04, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Падонки вас фсех отправят фтопку, если будете камментить, постя фсякий низачот. Серьёзно: сибвики приводится исключительно в качестве прецедента. Сам сибирский язык мы не о(б)суждаем. Edward Chernenko 12:09, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Да где не обсуждаете-то??? Когда вы научитесь говорить правду и перестанете говорить за "всех"?? Поднимите глаза выше, вы только и обсуждаете сибирский, в пять-шесть глоток. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 14:07, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]


You are complete right, and Siberian with it's strongly codified grammar, based on old Novgorod standards, 15 000 codified words, collected from 30 dictionaries, 1200 entries in living wiki, has no similiarity to that slangs that you have described. This is simply anti-siberian provocation in context of general ruwiki politics on persecution of the Siberian language. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 10:59, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps article about Newton in Olbanian language should be something like this:

Ньютон, нах. (Пендос. Newton). Превед, кросавчеги! Ньютон, нах, пендосский физег, нах! ТруЪ! Я кончел, нах! [[Category: Физеги]] --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 16:48, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose No slang Wikipedias please. What will be next? Wikipedia "в натуре"? Or "по фене"? --EugeneZelenko 13:23, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose И вообще, мне интересно, почему это те, кто сравнивают падонкаффский с сибирским, мол, если есть один, должно быть место и другому, теме не менее, голосуют за падонкаффский, но против сибирского. Где логика? --Kojpiš Anton, Miensk (kojpish@bk.ru) --194.158.213.175 13:25, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ну так за сибирский уже очень давно проголосовали, тогда и идеи созадния падонкаффской википедии не было. А теперь было принято решение о создании сибирской. Ну раз сибирский решили создавать, то пускай и падокаффский будет.VanHelsing.16
Голосование за сибирский продолжается. Оно может закончится только с открытием полноценной вики (не в инкубаторе). Я был бы всё же не против существования обоих вик вместе. Но вот например, вы проголосовали против сибирской и здесь голосуете за. (и не только вы, таких много). Именно поэтому я и проголосовал против падонкоффской. Если бы голосующие за падонкаффскую и оргоментирующие это "Ну раз сибирский решили создавать, то пускай и падокаффский будет" не голосовали бы против сибирской, я бы не голосовал против падонкаффской.--Kojpiš Anton 22:52, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Да это и так очевидно, что все шоу только для того и предназначено, чтобы не дать севернорусской вике открыться. То, что падонкоффский жаргон, на котором ни одной статьи написать невозможно, знают все участники дискуссии --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 06:48, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
А это что??? [1] Скоро откроют вашу вики 194.54.161.150 07:42, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Вот когда откроют, тогда мы и успокоимся, а сейчас я уверен, что вы только и добиваетесь, чтобы не было открытия, равняя молодой язык с жаргоном, годным только для написания той хуйни, что вы там понаписали. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 09:45, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Question By the way, when padonki test wiki will begin? If this is language, where are the articles? --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 16:31, 17 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Opened, but where is the encyclopedic content? Humorous articles, taken from russian Absurdopedia, and discussing of padonki slang. This is still russian language, untill specific grammar and wide dictionary will be developed. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 20:52, 18 August 2006 (UTC) I have translated one of the "articles" to the siberian language.[reply]

Padonki "article":

Падонкаффский йезыг, йезыг падонкаф, олбанский йезыг — распрастранифшейеся ф Рунети в начали XXI века аццкое наречие c фонетически адекватным, но нарачита ниправельным нопейсанием слофф (т. н. ыративом), частым упатриблением сцуко мата и штампоф, хороктерных длйа сленгоф. Такжы известин как «сленк дибилоф».

Исторея йезыга

Первонахом в дикабре 1998 года пайявился йезыг кощенитов. Учаснеги конфы SU.KASCHENKO.LOCAL начели хуярить на беспесды гламурном новом диалекти. Фскори, в 2000 году падонок Дмитрий Соколовский аткрыл кошерный и ниибаццо известный рисурс Удафком, на катором мнагачислинныйе хуяторы и фтыкатели марозили фсякуй хуйню, заложиф тем самым зачотную аснову йезыга. Затем в Рунети стала ниибаццо папулярна лытбырня "Жывой Журнал", ф которой ригулярна праводяцца флешмопы, отжыги и прочий ужоснах, беспесды обогатифшый йезыг падонкаф новыми жосскими олбанскими баянами вроди преведа.

Siberian article:

Падонковской говор ("язык падонкаф") — наречче Рунета, спето в зачале XXI столеття. Порушат веры россейсково правописа, корыстоват матерны и дружны сленговски словы, головны сторонки Udaff.com и Fuckru.net.

По сути являтса сленгом россейского говора, пото чо не имат особой говорогородки, число онцовых словов коло 30.

Деянни гимговых сленгов россейсково говора

Первой ведомой гимговой сленг притянулса в 1998 годе. Дольники сборишша SU.KASCHENKO.LOCAL зачали мышлеть новы сленговы словы рожаючейся россейской гимги. В 2000 году было открыто Удафком, головна сторонка гимговово сленга ажно досель. Падонковско наречче корыстуетса ешшо в "Живучем Бытейнике", де доселе рожаютса новы сленговы словечки.


Everybody can see, thet "padonki" article is not encyclopedic - it uses many words with indefinite meaning, expressing only feelings of slang users (like "отжыг", "сцуко"). The part which has some meaning is written in russian language, without any constant orthography. So there is no any attributes of language in this slang - no constant orthography, no specific grammar but russian grammar, no specific words but 30-50 slang words, using for everything because there are no other padonki words. This is good content for russian Absurdopedia, not for different wikipedia. No slang wikipedias were opened in english slangs or german slangs, etc. Meanwhile, Siberian is just language based on dialects, and it is fit for Wikipedia, but Padonki unfit.

  • Oppose. Padonki slang is more suitable for Uncyclopedia: this language section cannot be serious a priori. Just imagine language section with mangled english and abusive words. It is just unavailing: it can become really popular between udaff.com fans, but it will never become encyclopedic. The large support has been provoked because of misunderstanding about "siberian language" and should be annuled by en:WP:POINT. --ru:User:Boleslav1 11:37, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Первый случай, когда я полностью согласен с Болеславом)) Agreed. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 11:55, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose Strong oppose --Dmitry Nikitin 05:07, 25 August 2006 (UTC)it is second voice of Dmitry Nikitin --Nikolay Kolpakov 00:45, 26 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose Strong oppose. The fact that this slang is popular in Russia doesn't makes it a language. It has no own grammar and vocabulary consists of misspelled Russian words. And wikimedia would never be taken seriously in Russia if padonki wiki will be created. Please do not create this wiki, please do not rape Russian language. Kneiphof 12:43, 28 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strongly Oppose. - Like other Internet slangs (currently we have dozens, if not hundreds of them) this "language" is used exclusively in a rather special register of informal Internet communication. Any attempt to write academical or encyclopedical articles in it may be undertaken for the purposes of fun and amusement only. Let's not waste Wikimedia server space for childish toys. --Dmitry Gerasimov 10:45, 4 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Padonki bot

[edit]

And I should alert Wikipedia community and Wikimedia that padonki fans are preparing bot, which will convert 100 000 articles from ruwiki to "padonkian", simply changing their orthography, and adding words like "fuck". So 18-year boys like Chernenko want to take 1,5 Gb space from Wikimedia only for their fun, because the language is still russian slang, and this is described everywhere. The bot is discussed in LJ and russian wiki Community Portal. And adult nationalists from ruwiki support the young hooligans, simply because they hate other slavonic languages. This should be stopped as soon as possible, and the request closed. This is "Request for new languages" section, but not "Request for new slangs". --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 09:46, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Slander from the beginning to the end. Edward is a very competent coder and editor who would never do any harm to any Wikimedia project, whatever plans he may be discussing. His numerous contributions have been instrumental to the success of the Russian Wikipedia, and you need to get back to work instead of continuing your incoherent flames against our great new language, Edward's age (wtf does that have to do with anything?) and our contributions. Csman 22:25, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Let us see this. And this is complete OR that this is language, because any neutral sources tell that this is slang. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 22:36, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Before writing such accusatory post, you should take a look into mirror... "Chaldon-Siberian" methods on the march... --EugeneZelenko 14:16, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
It is impossible to write russian-chaldon bot, because languages are very different, and you know this. Please, explain, what similiarities can you found? I did not proclaim slang language, etc. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 14:39, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
If you implemented Ukrainian-to-Chaldon-Siberian converter, why padonki may not do same thing with Russian? :-) --EugeneZelenko 14:46, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
No, it was not implemented. We tried to do this, but failed, because even ukraine is very different, though closer. Ukrainians still write very few articles in sibwiki, because they do not know the language well, and the converter does not work. You can see the translators' code - it only changes orthography and some words, and can not translate well. It was never used, and if I would have this, we should write 10 000 articles, but not 1200. And Chernenko just says: "Видишь ли, мы и не собираемся писать огромное количество статей. У меня уже почти готов бот, который переработает все 100000 статей из ruwiki в падонкаффский" (http://samir74.livejournal.com/1003463.html). Such mistification can overload Incubator, ruwiki has about 1,5 Gb as far as I know. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 14:58, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
You tried but failed? Hm... That means only that you're worse programmers comparing to me. In fact, the script I was talking about is only spellchecker which applies some most common language rules to russian text; of course, all this articles need many manual work. And there was no idea to load 1.5 Gb to incubator, such suspision is like a very bad joke. Please stop insulting me and other padonkis. Edward Chernenko 16:32, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
"который переработает все 100000 статей из ruwiki в падонкаффский" - your own words, and you lie now. Also you lie about "language rules", padonki slang has no rules, no grammar or pronunciation were codified, so this is OR. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 20:33, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
You even deleted the post about the 100 000 articles, but it is silly - I have all the proofs. Do not be so stupid moscovite kid. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 02:45, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

[edit]

The work is starting on padonki test wikipedia here: http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Test-wp/pad Csman 20:08, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Translation of some incubator:Test-wp/pad articles

[edit]

To show you the level of padonkis' language independence we present some translations of it's articles.

  • Translation of Test-wp/pad/Россея article

In origin:

Россея - страна с беспесды пицот от Европы и Азеи.

Исчо Россея ф дисятке по ВВП, количеству учаснегов и ф сотне по зачотной жизни. Шышечка Россеи - президент, креатифным органом являиццо федеральное собранее.

Многие учаснеги Россеи считают, что живут не песдато и защитывают слив правительству, высок уровнь фубля жизни. Распространено мнение, что правительство мешает раскрывать тему сисек, в особенности после обоссаки с законом об экстримизме.

Russian translation:

Россия - страна, занимающая значительную часть Европы и Азии.

Также Россия - одна из десяти стран с наиболее высоким уровнем ВВП, но уровень жизни достаточно низок. Главой россии является президент, законодательным органом Федеральное собрание.

У граждан России распространены мнение о неудолетворительности условий их жизни и критика в адрес правительства, многие живут за чертой бедности. Часто считается, что в России правительством ущемляется свобода слова, в особенности после ситуации с Российским "Законом об экстремизме".

English translation:

Russia is the country that occupies a considerable part of both Europe and Asia.

Russia is one of ten counties with the highest GDP rating, but the life rate is rather low and the level of out of cost living is high. Russia is headed by the president and Federal meeting is the legislative body.

Russians often find their life poor and are not satisfacted by the work of the goverment. It is a diffused opinion that Russian goverment tries to infringe upon the freedom of speech, especially in the present state of Russian "Extremism law". Eugrus 23:27, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

And all the translations are incorrect. Because word "с беспесды" means only "cool", and not "occupy considerable part". "количеству учаснегов" is not equal to "population", because padonki slang has no specific word for "population". "Участнег" can mean "any person", but not "citizen", there is no word for "citizen" in the slang. Etc., etc. Padonki slang has NO WORDS for writing science articles in it, but it has many political incorrect words like "хохлы", "чурки", "пендосы" (the later is abusive russian word for "American"). Kashenite subset is antisemitic. And this is Original Research that Padonlki is a language, there is NO ARTICLE in the world, where this is called "language", all media articles discussing that names it "slang", and this IS abusive russian slang, nothing more. And you still not have constant orthography, just your example shows this. Please cease discriminate and persecute real ancient language of working people of northern Russia, Siberian Language, and promote your criminal nationalistic slang here. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 01:39, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
It's just because you don't speak in Padonkian. For native Padonkis, the text above is clear. Neither Russian, nor English translations are word-to-word translations. Despite "учаснег" is not a direct synonym to "гражданин" or "citizen", "учаснег Россеи" is synonymic to "гражданин Российской Федерации" and "Russian citizen". You may trace etymology easily: "гражданин" and "cizen" are derived from middle-age quasi-states ("города" and "cities"), while "учаснег" is created in context of the modern quasi-states (web-projects). Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 06:02, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
And this is lie. Word "учаснег" means "participant", but not "citizen". So they speak "participant of Russia" instead of "citizen" only because they have not particular word "citizen". Your own dictionary in ruwiki says: Учаснег, Соучаснег (превед-эрратив участник) — участник. (участник= participant) http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%96%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%BE%D0%BD_%D0%BF%D0%B0%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2

And you lie here even when my arguments are evident, even when EVERY "official" padonki dictionary has not more than 50 words, and it is evident, that nobody can write wikipedia using only 50 words. You lie, because your political motivation forces you to lie even in very clear topics, like slang nature of the Padonki slang. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 06:54, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Dear Yaroslav, you just didn't catch the idea behind my words: Russian "гражданин" (citizen) derived from "город" (city); compare Russian "гражданин" (citizen) and "горожанин" (townsman). Consider French word "citoyen" (citizen), derived from "cite" (city, town), and ititially it meant just "townsman". If citizenship is derived from "participation in city's life" in old languages, what's wrong in derivation of modern word for citizenship from "participation in project's life"? It seems nothing. Is it clear? Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 07:33, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
It is clear, that you have not specific word for "citizen", and use "participant" instead of citizen. The same is with many other words. Slang words are expressive, but they have indefinite meanings, and this is common thing in slangs. So Padonki slang is unfit for writing articles in it, because such articles will not have definite meanings. This is just like toki pona - you have only 50 words, and you invent their meanings depending on context. If you will continue this, I shall copy here large tables of meanings, in which you use such words like "отжыг" or "участнег". And you still have problems with orthography. You will be forced: or invent language in Wikipedia - this is original research - or write articles in russian language, simply damaging their orthography. And this is very easy to reveal, so I shall have fun during the nearest days, exposing your lie)))) --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 08:14, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The thing that language's lexicon is relatively poor doesn't make it useless and doesn't disallow us to use wider concepts instead Eugrus 08:34, 19 August 2006 (UTC).[reply]
Yes, Eugrus, and this is the thing which I want to reveal! Language's lexicon is relatively poor, and unfit for wikipedia. Just read my position in current dicussion in LJ - "Это статьи на русском языке с использованием 10 жаргонных слов. Именно что это не годится для википедии, правила которой отрицают эмоциональную оценочность. Если бы там были словарь, грамматика, и это годилось бы для выражения хоть чего-то кроме эмоциональной оценки, то да, я считал бы языком"

There is no meaning 'гражданин' in current dictionaries of Padonki slang. So inventing the meaning in Wikipedia is definitely Original Research.--Yaroslav Zolotaryov 08:42, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I see, you still didn't catch the idea. It's quite easy: in middle age, people had no specific word for "citizen", and used "townsman" instead; (add German "Buerger" from "Burg" here - I forgot to mention it above). The same with "учаснег Россеи". And the second: I have no any problems. I don't have any plans to participate in creation of Padonkian texts, maybe minor corrections only; in this area, I'm just a researcher. Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 08:23, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I catched the idea. but the idea is OR, because the idea is absent in non-wikipedia dictionaries of Padonki slang. It is good to research slangs, but slangs are definitely unfit for wikipedia articles. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 08:42, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I don't bother about that. I have just proved a fact that your assertion: '"Участнег" can mean "any person", but not "citizen"' is wrong. "Участнег" CAN mean "citizen". That's all, and all other your points do not matter in this context. Dr Bug (Vladimir V. Medeyko) 12:38, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
"Участнег" CAN mean "citizen", because "ciizen" is person. And "Участнег" means "any person". There are no other neutral words in the slang for the persons, others are abusive. So you can not write wikipedia by such a language where meaning of the words are indefinite, you can only joke by it, so the slang can be used in Absurdopedia only --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 12:51, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Dude, once again, can you leave us alone, please? We let you have your own personal wikipedia in whatever slang you have, why don't you apply all that immense energy of yours to it! Go on and create new things, don't just keep shitting on others, that's what I would suggest. Csman 10:02, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
And this is the last argument that you have:-) No shit on you, just speaking truth. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 10:17, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

One more "translation"

[edit]

Padonki: Жывой Журнал (пендосский LiveJournal) -- пендосская лытбырня, ставшайя беспесды папулярной в Рунети посли 2002 года. Сриди учаснегов лытбырни -- гламурные деффачки, олкоголеки, многие падонки и флешмопперы, а такжы многийе знаминитые пейсатели и прочие афтары.

English:

LiveJornal (abusive word for Americans, LiveJournal) - blog of cursed Americans, cool and popular in Russia after 2002 year (the rest of the sentence is written in Russian - Y.Z.). It's participants are - prostitutes, alcoholics, criminals and flashmobers, and many well-known writers (the last word is changed antisemitically - Y.Z.) and other authors.

Where is science? Where is objectivity? It is impossible to write articles in criminal slang, and Wikipedia will loss it's reputation publishing politically incorrect and abusive articles. But there is no possibility to write normal articles in abusive language. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 02:01, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Even russian wikipedia article is named "Жаргон падонков" (Padonki SLANG)(http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%96%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%BE%D0%BD_%D0%BF%D0%B0%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2). This is definitely slang, even CLASSICAL example of slang, and to name it language is definitely OR. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 02:28, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This translation is fully falsification. "Гламурные деффачки, олкоголеки, многие падонки и флешмопперы" are all names for communities, but not the things are written behind.
"Падонки" is the name for the language speakers. "Гламурные деффачки" is the name for stylish girls, it is formed from Russian "glamourous girls", but has a separate meaning, and of couse it has nothing in common with prostitutes, the only reason for such translation was to discredit us.
Somewhy User:Yaroslav Zolotaryov also calls us nationalists when we hate and have nothing in common with nationalizm, and again, the only reason is to to discredit us
Eugrus 08:22, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Just show me padonki dictionary to prove that my translation is wrong. Slang words have indefinite meanings, so деффачки can be translated like "girls" or like "prostitutes", and by very-very other ways. Also with the word падонки and others. And what means the word алкоголики if not alcoholics? And nationalism is just using words хохлы and пендосы, and пейсатели --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 08:33, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
English for "пейсатели" is just "writes" and has no link for any nations. User:Yaroslav Zolotaryov is trying to hype. Eugrus 08:41, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Every Russian understands the etimology of the word пейсатели - russian писатели (writers) was mispronounced so it is no similiar to the word пейсы, and пейсы is attribute of jewish culture. The whole kashenite slang is antisemitic, as my belorussian friend have already said, and you know this, but lie. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 08:52, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I'am a Jew and I do not find anything abusive for me in padonkis' language. I also sure you that пейсатели has no ethimological connection to пейсы Eugrus 09:24, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
And this is your subjective position, but other persons find it. This is common thing with slangs, where words have no definite meanings. Meanwhile, authors of the Padonkian wiki write now definite lie in the articles - for example, article http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Test-wp/pad/%D0%9F%D0%B0%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%BA%D0%B0%D1%84%D1%84%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%B9%D0%B5%D0%B7%D1%8B%D0%B3 now contains information "Padonki language has 300000 words" which is not proved by external sources and this is definitely lie. So your Padonki wikipedia is version of Russian Absurdopedia, but you already has Absurdopedia, written in russian language using Padonki words. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 09:33, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
You are not right at all. There are 300.000 words used in language's own spelling and neary 100 having their own principially new meanings. Eugrus 10:17, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
And where is the dictionary where the 300 000 words are codified? Padonki slang have no codified spelling, and this is written in every article about it. And please provide any link about the 100 words with new meanings too. Even 30 words mentioned in the dictionary in ruwiki are mostly uncorrectly spelling russian words or common russian words using in expressive meanings --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 10:35, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Huh. Then give a link to Siberian dictionary VanHelsing.16
http://totem.in.ua/sib/dict.php Online version. http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Test-WP/chal/%D0%96%D1%8B%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B9_%D1%81%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BA_%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%B1%D0%B8%D1%80%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BE_%D0%B3%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B0 Wiki version. And I have many more links, because we work with dictionary very hard. Siberian has very codified grammar and wide dictionary, but padonki is stupid slang of young russians like you, and nothing more. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 09:49, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • I really do not like the way Падонкаффская Википедия developes. The slang once used for joking will never be able for anything else, veiled en:mat will never be a language, even if I and other russian users could inspire people who do not know russian with it. Wikipedia is not the place for me and for us to train in incompitent jurors' persuasion. I will not play for trail-blazers' team any more. So I am now strongly Oppose. I do not want a non-language Wikipedia to exist. My ex. allies, please stop, we have to stop this idling. Eugrus 23:20, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Альтернатива

[edit]

Уважаемые коллеги! В связи с несоответствием требованиям Википедии мы не можем расчитывать на размещение http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Test-wp/pad в качестве языкового раздела Википедии, продолжение работы здесь в конечном итоге приведёт к её полной потере!

Предлагаю нам переместиться на отдельный проект, который я готов хостировать.

Через сутки он будет доступен по адресу http://padonkopedia.org.ru

В ближайшие сутки следует использовать временный адрес http://padonkopedia-org-ru.eugrus.org.ru

Туда были перемещены все написанные статьи, кроме откровенно-направленных на дискредитацию Падонкопедии. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Eugrus (talk • contribs) .

Не могли бы вы прежде чем стирать главную страницу, написать кто, почему и где именно вдруг стал угрожать нашему размещению в инкубаторе? Сейчас, при всём уважении, это выглядит, как вандализм. Csman 01:30, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Полностью согласен. Я ведь к самому сленгу то хорошо, и статьи были хорошие, смешные. Но это не для энциклопедии. Уважаю вас за мужественный поступок. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 01:33, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
ответил в http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Test-wp/pad Eugrus 01:44, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Не надо пудрить мозги! Сибирский соотвествует а падонкаффский видишь ли нет! :) --Morpheios Melas 06:02, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Именно вам и не надо пудрить мозги. Совершенно очевидно, что именно так и есть: сибирский соответствует, а падонковский нет. Причины этого уже изложены, и повторять их не буду. --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 06:54, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
VERY funny discussion between the young russians in "padonki" test wiki by the way - "Because it is clear, that the slang is unfit for wikipedia, let us only damage russian orthography and name this padonki language" (http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Test-wp/pad) LOL)))) --Yaroslav Zolotaryov 07:22, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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