Meta:Babel/Archives/2019-12

Padlock overhaul

Since late 2018, English Wikipedia, Wikimedia Commons and some other Wikimedia projects no longer use old File:Padlock-COLOR.svg padlocks. The new design is intended to be informative, simple and up-to-date. c:Category:Page Protection Padlock Redesign (2018) shows all new icons by their color.

Meta still uses old padlocks. Since they have been created in 2007, they represent a somehow old design. Also, they aren't informative for new users. Another problem is that all padlocks on Meta currently link to English Wikipedia's protection policy, which uses the new padlock design. I suggest we change all the padlocks. Since Meta is a multilingual project, I suggest we use symbol-based padlocks instead of letter-based ones. I have provided a list of suggestions in the table below:

Type	Old	New	Alternatives
Semi-
Extended
Create
Move
Upload
Pending
Template-
Permanently
Full
Office
Cascade

I can conduct the change if no oppose rises within one or two weeks. Thank you. Ahmad^talk 15:45, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

@Ahmad252: can you point to some examples of these in use? I just checked 10 semi-random pages from Special:ProtectedPages and don't see these being used at all. Also meta-wiki does not have all those levels, and does have other levels. — xaosflux ^Talk 16:45, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

One lock is enough. This is not English Wikipedia nor Commons. Stryn (talk) 16:50, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

@Xaosflux and Stryn: Yes, I see. Although Meta doesn't have all of them, Module:Protection banner/config does. Removing them from the module shouldn't be difficult, but I think they may become useful in the future. This change won't effect a lot of pages, as Module:Protection banner is only used in less than 250 pages, and all those pages are templates/modules. This means that only >250 pages currently have a padlock, so the change is, in my opinion, fairly uncontroversial. The purpose of this proposal is mainly changing the fully-protected padlock, but I think changing them all is a better idea. Of course, we can remove the additional padlocks from the module and change only one or two padlocks. Ahmad^talk 16:59, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

Even as an experienced user, I find the new padlocks much more helpful. I support this change. ~riley (talk) 17:51, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

The symbols make no sense at all, and the colours are deeper so the blues and greens look nearly identical on some screens. They are substantially less informative and are probably the worst design choice en.wiki has made in a while. Given it's not a huge deal, but the new ones really are hideous as icons go. TonyBallioni (talk) 01:58, 12 December 2019 (UTC)

I don't get it. Why are they "less informative"? I mean, what can we understand a green padlock, and what is the difference between a green and a purple padlock? Can you guess what they mean if you have never been active in Wikimedia projects before? Ahmad^talk 16:59, 12 December 2019 (UTC)

I edit at night because I work in the day. Like many editors, I have my computer set to night mode so I can go to bed at some point. This is a common setting on most devices used to access the internet these days. I can't tell a difference between create, move, and cascade protections, and extended looks very close. Pending and semi-protection also look identical. To the significant portion of the editing population that has a day job and edits when they get off of work, substantially less information is conveyed if they use the settings that are recommended for being on a computer at night. This is only a problem with the new ones, not with the old ones. The weird symbols convey no meaning and the only one I'd be able to guess is upload protection. The rest are just random symbols that don't appear to have any relationship to what the protection is. So yes: the new ones aren't really compatible with the night modes that are common on new computers these days, making them less informative. TonyBallioni (talk) 01:23, 13 December 2019 (UTC)

• Meh. The en.wiki overhaul didn't really do anything and the old version looks nicer. The new versions are ugly and despite the claim during the en.wiki implementation, don't convey any additional information unless you already know what they mean. Oppose as not needed on meta and in addition to being ugly. TonyBallioni (talk) 01:50, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
• Comment I think that we only use semi- and full, so 1) I don't think it matters either way, they are indicators only; 2) that the change makes little difference to what happens here. That two wikis have moved is neither here nor there and many wikis use the old schema. That said, I am okay about updating the two templates that we use; though I do not wish to see a further implementation of a more convoluted scheme. KISS principle works here.  — billinghurst sDrewth 02:42, 12 December 2019 (UTC)

  Further comment: Both modules are fully protected so only admins will making any changes. Ping to importer and protecter ... @MarcoAurelio:  — billinghurst sDrewth 02:47, 12 December 2019 (UTC)

  @Billinghurst: Please see my comment above. I listed all the padlocks, beacuse they are included in the module. Changing them will not affect anything now, but if we add a, say, extended-protection level in the future, the padlock will be of the type I've suggested above. In fact, the only visible changes are full and semi-protection padlocks. Ahmad^talk 16:55, 12 December 2019 (UTC)

• In my course as an admin on Meta, I have never seen or used an template (for the padlocks and others) -- do we really use it - or put it other way, do we really need it? — regards, Revi 01:44, 13 December 2019 (UTC)

  @-revi: I don't think we really need them at all, and it looks like the only place they are really in use at all is via templates with documentation pages called by another template, that calls a module, that calls another module (Module:Protection banner), that calls the lock template, that then uses these icons. That being said, I don't really have any problems with changing the icon file. — xaosflux ^Talk 03:17, 13 December 2019 (UTC)

• I personally hate the newer version but not much a diff as per -revi, I also seldom see this (I can't imagine semi protect a talkpage and then add the padlock logo - way go against DENY or etc), so no harm just changing. Just a note per above comments that if ever we need to do ECP here, which is really a stretch, then E cannot be sufficient. This may need to take into consideration. --Camouflaged Mirage (talk) 10:18, 30 December 2019 (UTC)