Talk:Tamil-Malayalam Community Collaboration

Initiations in Tamil Wikimedia

• You can find few efforts before this page, here. Now focusing in Wiktionary and wiksource. I think we will cintinue after SVG camp. You too!--Info-farmer (talk) 04:22, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

Sure. We can discuss more about and create a list in local wiki page.-Jinoytommanjaly (talk) 14:30, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

Works to be done

• To create this type of table. We should write codes.--Info-farmer (talk) 04:27, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

A similar table can be created in meta page also. So that we can monitor those articles created in both Malayalam and Tamil.-Jinoytommanjaly (talk) 14:32, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

Some Helpful Wikidata Queries for Adding Language Labels and Descriptions

Some Helpful Wikidata Queries

For Tamil Community

• Human settlements in Kerala
• Humans born in Kerala

For Malayalam Community

• Human settlements in Tamilnadu
• Humans born in Tamilnadu

Note: I am not expert Wikidata Query Service, If anyone improve these Queries Please Ping me. I am really happy. Thank you Sriveenkat (talk) 13:20, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

How to kickstart the activities of this forum?

Perhaps, I am the lone contributor to the Discussion page at least over the past one month. This is not, I am sure, we aspire for. This situation has led me to believe that we are yet in the dark as to how to kickstart the activities of this forum. Let me share a couple of thoughts that come to my mind apart from the valuable suggestions/guidelines that appear above on this page.

1. Spell-check the contributions made by users in languages other than their own and rectify where needed, but through discussions on the Discussion page of the article concerned. E.g., Incidentally I landed on a featured Wiki-Malayalam page that apparently is on a popular religious site in Tamil Nadu and found the caption of the page mis-spelt. The Tamil page caption that begin with the word அண்ணாமலையார் appeared in Malayalam as അണ്ണാമലൈയ്യർ, both when pronounced (Annamalaiyar) sounds almost similar but not the same. The emphasis on the letter equivalent to y in the Malayalam language changes the meaning altogether. I have left my comments on the Discussion page wherein I have highlighted the effect of the misspelling, recommending correction of the page title. It is noteworthy that the same page has been translated in multiple Indian languages besides English, but the title changed according to the linguistic preference of the users concerned.
2. Users who have volunteered to enlist themselves in this group are requested to necessarily prioritize their time so as to allot at least a reasonable percentage to work on Tamil-Malayalam or Malayalam-Tamil translation projects, reviewing articles created by users in language(s) other than their own native tongue. This will help improve the quality of articles in both these languages. I have taken it upon myself to practise this rather than keep professing.

Creating a collaboration forum that does not serve the intended purpose will be futile and hence these observations.

Sree1959 (talk) 08:23, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Sree1959

Thank you for sharing your insights and proactive approach to improving the collaboration. Your suggestions to prioritize time for collaborative efforts resonate well with the goal of enhancing the quality of articles across languages. Since the page was created some years back there was not that much discussions happened there after. During the WikiConferernce India 2023 we (@Netha Hussain, @Neechalkaran, @Info-farmer) had a small chat about the future plans about the collaboration. I think we can initiate discussions about the collaboration activities that can be undertaken in each community during their community meetups / discussions and move forward together. I can start this discussion in the next Wikimedians of Kerala UG monthly meetup, and if anyone from the Tamil community can initiate this discussion in their community meetup, we can proceed.

Let's continue working together to make this space a vibrant and productive space for all contributors. ❙❚❚❙❙ GnOeee ❚❙❚❙❙ ✉ 09:35, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

Great, thank you very much. I shall try to impress upon the Tamil Wikimedians as well.

Sree1959 (talk) 13:28, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

I think we must prioritize the work related to Tamil-Malayalam dictionary integration to Wikidata lexeme project. --Netha Hussain (talk) 12:09, 4 January 2024 (UTC)

At the end of half year, we are unable to find the existing ml-ta dictionaries in text form. Let us create using crowd sourcing. I will try to plan so steps to build it. We will have some catchup call soon to bring more energy to this collaboration. -Neechalkaran (talk) 09:16, 18 February 2024 (UTC)

@Sree1959 Thank you for your suggestions and articles. We were tring to pull some base bilingual dictonary but it was not successful, then we were committed with other works. Now We need to kick start again. The spelling suggestions are worth when both communities are activity here. Now we are looking for foundation activities. Do you know Malayalam and can you help in verify the malayalam Tamil dictionary building? -Neechalkaran (talk) 09:10, 18 February 2024 (UTC)

Yes @Neechalkaran, I am able to handle both Malayalam and Tamil almost with the same proficiency level and am willing to help in whatever possible manner. Thank you. Sree1959 (talk) 09:22, 18 February 2024 (UTC)

@Sree1959 Some issues I saw in tawiki: കുറുപ്പ് translating the Kurup from English: குருப் (Google also translating like this), Correct form transliterating from Malayalam: குறுப்பு Sriveenkat (talk) 13:44, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

Yes, you are absolutely right. There are some such anomalous situations between these two languages. One aspect has been the distinct characteristics of the respective languages. For example, രാമൻ in Malayalam is written as இராமன் in Tamil; കുഞ്ഞിരാമൻ is written as குஞ்சிராமன். You may also note that Tamil Wikipedians follow a set of guidelines that warrants certain words to adhere to a particular rule even if the word is written and pronounced differently in Malayalam. E.g., சிறீதர் is used for ശ്രീധർ. In contrast, Malayalam Wikipedians insist that popular words or phrases in other languages should not be translated, but used as they are pronounced in the original language. E.g., പാടൽ പെട്ര സ്ഥലം is used for பாடல் பெற்ற தலம்! This is even when ற்ற has its Malayalam equivalent in റ്റ, but don't ask me why the rule is not followed 100% as தலம் is not written as തലം, but instead is translated as സ്ഥലം! I think, you can't expect a satisfactory explanation for everything. Sree1959 (talk) 16:29, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

Yes, Thank you! Sriveenkat (talk) 23:19, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

Bulk Articles for Tamil nadu Panchayats

@Akbarali As discussed, Below the steps we used to create bulk articles. We cleaned and created data in google spreadsheet. Using Google Apps script we created articles. sample articles and this is the project page. Either we can create wikidata item and create article from that. where we need some property needs to be created. On other hand create the article using BOT and later create wikidata item for available properties. We need to think and decide on this. Neechalkaran (talk) 05:51, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Thank you @Neechalkaran for this detailed report and files. i have created some Malayalam articles using census data about villages in Odisha state. I hope using above data, we can create articles about TN villages in Malayalam wiki. Instead of Google App Script, I was using python and pwb.Let me check the data that you shared in google sheet. Akbarali (talk) 18:45, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Akbarali created these articles using his own useraccount insted of a bot account. And there was no official disussion happened in the Malayalam Community. So I was forced to block him from editing. And all the articles created with that PAWS script is still a mess. Please refrain from doing these kind of activity in a Wikipedia. @Akbarali Please do a discussion before doing any kind of bot activity. Ranjithsiji (talk) 15:30, 19 April 2024 (UTC)

This is to clarify the confusion raised here and in malayalam admin page.

They are manually created  articles  using data from a pre-existing source.

Here's a detailed explanation of my process:

- I collected data from a reliable source .

- I manually wrote article and added the data from source  ensuring they met Wikipedia's guidelines.

- I copied and pasted the content into Wikipedia, carefully referencing the original source.

As per Wikipedia's policy, manual copying and pasting from a pre-existing source is allowed if properly referenced .And they are submitted by clicking myself. Only 1 article we have created using PWB in the category: villages of Odisha. And we have started a discussion about Tamilnadu panchayath articles into Malayalam on our village pump today,since we have created only 2 article till this time. Akbarali (talk) 14:24, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

- The source is not official. So there is no confirmation that the data is correct.

-copying and pasting content from another source is a clear license violation whether those source are also in cc-by-sa license.

-According to en:WP:MEATBOT before doing any kind for bot editing a person must gain consensus from the community.

- There is a discussion going on to create Tamilnadu panchayath articles into Malayalam on the village pump. The final decision is not reached. But you are creating more articles using the script mentioned above. Also lot of references missing and Infobox in Tamil wikimedia is missing in Malayalam Wikipedia. So this is not a good practice. Ranjithsiji (talk) 07:53, 12 May 2024 (UTC)